Any unburnt fuel in the engine that goes into the exhaust system will ignite in the catalytic converter. Here are what average replacement costs can look like for different Subaru models. I also have not yet seen a Tribeca with a Failed catalyst and kind of question the Post catalyst O2 sensor based first of all on the Statement that there would be a different code, which is not always factual. The warranty complicates things and can create a situation where the Dealer will want to try the 02 sensors and it may temporarily resolve the issue and get the vehicle out of the warranty period. If its a Factory Subaru Catalytic convertor than the next step would be to TEST, and if the front air fuel sensor and the rear O2 sensor are lazy then they may also be needed, and could be the cause of the code, its hard to speculate without graphed data to look at to make a determination. 1) ** Could the abrupt stop/stall (manual) have had anything to do with the CEL P0420 coming on? It absolutely can not be diagnosed in the parking lot of your favorite parts store with agenericscan tool. A fuel mixture that is too rich, i.e. Clare. The code is back now, P0420 again. Catalytic Converter. Could, over time, a caps plastic threading weaken/degrade allowing it to work itself loose with regular driving?! Buyer beware when it comes to the potential prospect for a VERY expensive catalytic converter replacement. Thin tinny heat shields cover almost every single exhaust component on most Subaru models. There is a more accurate way to check if the catalytic converter is clogged in your Subaru Outback. A fuel mixture that is too rich, i.e. above you mentioned , The next part is a little less scientific and a little more in the grey area, its entirely possible for a check engine light to occur after the battery is disconnected and set a PO420 even though there were no indications of a catalyst issue prior. I suspect they did not do much more than that.. This is the only place on the web where I found a reference to my issue! Thats what happens when I post after my bedtime! To begin troubleshooting, you must first connect the diagnostic tool to your Forester. Very good advice on P0420. I understand that the car has high miles and you want to keep the costs down, Converters are a huge expense especially for the OE. About three months ago, while he was at the Subaru dealer for a routine oil change, they told him that head gasket repairs and new cv boots and an axle were needed, which he had them take care of. 83000 miles on it and I get the dreaded P0420 code. So I had both front bearings replaced. Im still getting the same gas mileage. What can I check next? I like you have also experience the cat converter which as been a problem since owning the car. I have a 2004 Legacy with the 420 code. What do you think of this?? Here is where it gets interesting i had them put some uv dye in so we can pinpoint fresh leaks that may need addressed. In the last 10 days the CEL and cruise have come on and off twice. The industry or the market place rather does not allow for scientifically approaching the issue with a prove good or prove failed circumstance, instead its not an exact science unless you have the ability or the inclination to go one or several steps further in your diagnoses. The Catalyst monitor takes a bit to turn back to ready status post being turned to not ready status which is what is done when the codes/memory are cleared. Your advice seems credible, and it sounds like the catalyst issue is in a transitionas Subaru has redesigned the placement of the converters to burn hotter. The day after I posted that I came to a sudden stop when a green light turned to red and my Suby violently shook as I came to a stop. The aftermarket cats just dont last very long and the slightest amount of carbon prevents function. Justin, Thanks for getting back to me. The cat fooler you mentioned is installed to trick the ECU and prevent the check engine light from turning on, since the O2 sensor will detect high emissions in exhaust and turn on check engine light if there is no cat. THANKS. Should I make sure they checked the O2 sensors, A/F fuel ratio, ECT, MAP before I allow them to replace it? Webexhaust pipe containing the catalytic converter. What, if any, additional trouble shooting should I request on the fuel pressure regulator? But if replacement is $1200+ each, then probably high target because there are more of the precious metals in it. The only way to cut down on this is to put more precious metal in the Catalyst which would greatly raise the price. Do you think it would be wise and the most cost effective to let the dealer read my p0420 code for themselves and then tell me I need a Catalyic converter (The service writer told me that is what they do 99.9% of the time with the p0420 code). Recall date. Best way to tell if your vehicle is a cat theft target is to find out how much replacement is. Sadly yes by 5k I told them I am waiting to replace it, have another mechanic who I want to take it to. In fact, I am not even part of the recent recall Jan 2013. Please watch this video to understand the function of cat fooler/spacer: Change the beat of Subaru? In addition to the vehicle make, model, and engine type, you usually also have to type in the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN). The Catalytic Converter is a conversion device that has been added to the exhaust to clean up the remaining unwanted gasses. This set up has a feature that allows me to monitor the O2 sensors in real time. Ammonia (NH 3) odor may also indicate poor catalyst function. Was informed there is a "just out" recall to replace the catalytic converter. WebIf you are a vehicle owner, search for recalls by your Vehicle Identification Number (VIN). Good luck! I checked the code and it was the P0420. From what I understood they are only going by OBD diagnostics. Full Diagram #44102B EXHAUST. A gas cap being loose would never cause a PO420, it could set a P0457 or P0440 however. Since some OBD codes are manufacturer-specific, the scanner will be able to give you more accurate information if you enter more details about your Forester. Maybe just drive it for a bit and see how it goes? Should I replace the aftermarket front bearings with OEM bearings? Because of the awkward angles and the small size of the Subaru converters--especially in the front Y-pipe--finding the right size and then welding it into the existing pipe without compromising how it needs to bolt to the engine and the remaining exhaust system is very difficult. I plan on putting another 70k on this car, so Im not opposed to necessary repairs/maintenance no matter the cost. Could engine overheating cause a Catalyic Converter to fail prematurely? 180,xxxkm id really like to stay away from the OEM $400+ part if i could do it for less by just replacing with aftermarket. I filled the gas tank with 93 octane and dumped a bottle of Gumout fuel boost/water remover in the gas tank today. Testing now. Subaru vehicles generally run well, and catalytic converters rarely fail unless something causes the damage. Most times if we make the repairs the same visit we will discount or waive the diagnostic fee. Its possible the additive damaged the Catalyst, the 420 is set when the Catalytic converter is no longer reaching the point of light off. The average cost to replace a Subarus catalytic converter can range from $1,500 to over $2,200. The mechanic told me I needed a new catalytic converter, because a friend suggested I try using a spark plug non fouler on my rear O2 sensor to clear the code Didnt work. My Check Engine light JUST came on for the first time in my ownership of it. Can you give some advice?? You didnt mention if the Catalyst was replaced with a OE Subaru part or a aftermarket Catalyst? I cant tell why its giving this code. Full Diagram #44102B EXHAUST. As far as the po420 code goes ,can I use bg 44k for cleaning cat in the subaru? and I am hoping for easy fix.previous owner says c.e.l. What I do question is what are the actual conditions that throw a P0420 code (ie. my CAT is good, Ive changed the secondary O2 sensor as well, searched for leaks before O2 sensors, did not find any. Subaru Forester 2009, Catalytic Converter and Pipe Assembly by Davico. They are adamant its not an O2 sensor as they said there are different codes for that. These metals give the catalytic converter a 3-way operating characteristic that can changeCO, HC and N0x to inert gases like CO2. Subaru makes a Great Safe & Reliable AWD vehicle. Any suggestions?? Second, I installed a Torque Pro App on my android phone and purchased a blue tooth compatable code sender. Learn More. Faulty Catalytic Converter. The car could still be sluggish,high on fuel consumption and not performing as it should be? They also swapped O2 sensors from LHS to RHS and still got the same reading. P0420 was showing If I am understanding your previous commentary, clearing the P0051 code (via reconnecting the battery) after replacing the front O2 sensor could have erased the values for the system and instead created a smaller acceptable interval, right? https://allwheeldriveauto.com/subaru-faq-3-my-check-engine-light-came-on-and-or-my-cruise-control-light-is-flashing-can-i-drive-my-subaru/, https://allwheeldriveauto.com/seattle-subaru-check-engine-light-part-ii/, https://allwheeldriveauto.com/your-subaru-check-engine-light-explained/. That the Dealer should have another look. Now, here is my question. Hi Justin, Here is the sequence of events: i go have the code cleared maybe it was just burning some stuff off. CEL has been off for about 2 weeks but came back on last night (no driveability problems). I have an innovate LM2 wideband sensor, can I use it to get the information necessary to better know whether or not I need a new CAT or O2 sensors? EXHAUST, Engine, CP - OEM Subaru Part # 44620AA750. Another guy from Canada. It could have a failed Catalyst or a rear 02 sensor, or both. Air bags. Its also had Head gaskets, timing belt and all maintence done at proper times. I have heard that sometimes reflashing the ECU can take care of this P0420 code reflash problem so I am thinking of trying that first. Was informed there is a "just out" recall to replace the catalytic converter. exhaust cover '06my. Had the CE light come on, took to the same Subaru dealership (Wagners in Fairborn, OH great place) and the diagnosis was rear O2 sensor. I had my regular Subaru mechanic check the code and it was 0420. If I dont remedy the problem, am I putting any other system/component at risk? Opps, I forgot my third question. Hope that helps and best of luck going forward. This one is a 2008 and just over two weeks ago was at a subaru dealer in St. Louis to replace the left or right front axle. The difference in price is $300 more it seems. Hello, very informative site thank you for taking the time to share your knowledge and answer questions. Closed Public Holidays) or email at feedback@subaru.com.au. With the tool connected, turn on the ignition. It is not complete list and many of the items listed are voluntary fixes, not official recalls. It can run into problems over the normal life of the vehicle, and is often accompanied by OBDII code P0420. Any chance a remaining leak could be the root cause of this code? Later that day, the light no longer appeared. If replacement is $200-$300, probably not a high target. Not a Subaru dealer, so I think it was aftermarket. You must know what is a normal reading however in order to know if the data shown is acceptable or not. It took me about 5 years post education to be a good enough technician to really be able to accurately diagnose these type of conditions and even then sometimes more experience may generate even better results such as a better understanding of cause and effect which can lead to fault prevention. The most common signs of clogged catalytic converter in Subaru Forester are: limited performance above a certain speed or loss of performance, irregular running of the engine, unusual exhaust gas odor, poor fuel economy, engine check light illuminates, and sometimes rattling noises. -O2 Sensors switching in normal ranges on test drive; air fuel sensors are constant as well the Cat was oem replacment on a wrx, and after 5k kilometres it had a big crash and was direct replacment for me. Cannot find any reference. I appreciate your reply. Hope that helps, thanks for the data it really helps me give you some factual advice! I did manage to speak directly to the technician and he seemed knowledgeable and thought that the front and rear sensors were ok, but that the catalyst needed to be replaced. So hes leaning towards the Cat being replaced. Learn More. Really cant speculate on whats the matter, its possible the booster is failing but that would be very uncommon. If you notice higher than 3 psi (0.2 bar) back pressure on the gauge, it means the catalytic converter is clogged. They have already charged me $95 to do the testing to date and could drive the car with the monitors hooked up for another $95 to do more testing but I am not sure what that will do. Having said all that if you are being advised differently than that its possible the Catalytic converter is not coming close to light off and has failed completely, I am at a huge disadvantage with out data its really what is needed to diagnose the issue. Its not a fuel ratio thing, not sure why that would come up? EXHAUST & MUFFLER '04MY-'05MY. Many thanks in advance! From there use the graph as a example of what to look for. Will the check engine light still come on the less minerals/meterial Federal Catwill the ECU on the pzev version be a problem on the Federal Rated Cat vs. the California one? The catalytic converter was allegedly replaced at a Subaru dealership under recall. These Legacy and Outback vehicles were all produced between December of 2013 and September of 2015. went oncode po420. It is not uncommon to see yet another converter downstream integrated in the construction of an intermediate pipe. I have an 01 Sub Legacy. Chemicals and Exhaust Temps can acheive this, you can also remove the Convertor and sensors and try soaking it. environment. A sulfur or "rotten egg" smell indicates the formation of hydrogen sulfide (H 2 S), a likely sign of catalytic converter contamination. Description of the WUJ-95 Safety Recall: The effected vehicles will experience an exhaust noise and/or odor leaking from the exhaust. So it doesnt help me determine whats wrong but puts the odds in favor of the convertor being restricted with carbon and not reaching temperature. Ammonia (NH 3) odor may also indicate poor catalyst function. New or recent doesnt always mean its ok, it needs to be tested to know if its good. All Wheel Drive Auto, LLC is an Independent Subaru Service and Repair Facility. 2022 Subaru Outback Base {{loadingIndicator}} Hamburger menu. If it is because I had the battery out for so long what do I do to fix it. This is my first Subaru. 370 people reported this problem 140 comments Subaru Forester Vehicles With This We were still in contact with the seller and he came and checked it out and code P0420 came up, but he said that it was nothing to be worried about and turned the light off. Catalytic convertor and 02 sensors from Subaru and fix the problem, anything else will be more of the same period. Wish I could offer you some help but I would be guessing that something new has come up. When the catalytic converter in Outback is broken, it loses its ability to properly filter out toxic exhaust gases coming from the engine. In fact, the local Subaru dealership sends many of their customers with P0420s to this shop because of the outrageous costs for the catalytic converters on Canadian Subarus (only 2 converters on Outbacks found in Canada, $2600 and $1300 for the two cats). Any suggestions you have would be greatly appreciated. Another more slightly annoying feature Subaru owners discover about the exhaust system on their vehicles are heat shield rattles. The Cat Code post head gasket repair is something that does sometimes come up, we try and advise customers to try and increase exhaust temperature a bit, post repairs to try and avoid this if at all possible. I have a 2003 Subaru Forester with a P0420 trouble code. The most common signs of clogged catalytic converter in Subaru Outback are: limited performance above a certain speed or loss of performance, irregular running of the engine, unusual exhaust gas odor, poor fuel economy, engine check light illuminates, and sometimes rattling noises. At 75,000 mile maintenance, Dealer replaced head gasket under warranty. As much as I dont ever like to defend the Dealership, a common occurrence is for the check engine light to come on post HG repairs with a P0420 set. Also, thanks for taking the time to help out fellow Subaru drivers. Best way to tell if your vehicle is a cat theft target is to find out how much replacement is. They said could come on in 2 days or 2 months, or longer. Is this a reasonable thing to do? The P0172 needs to be diagnosed and addressed and it just should not be driven until it has been I am afraid. Saab owners may contact the Saab Customer Assistance Center at 1-800-955-9007. Thanks! Justin, After dumping money into these repairs, last thing I want to find is that I now need more expensive repairs. Now I need to go talk to them to see what they did. Start the engine of your Subaru Forester and wait until it is at the right operational temperature level. We purchased a used 2002 Outback wagon recently. I have a few Questions to help educate myself of the safest rout to go. If the oxygen sensor develops a fault, it will send incorrect readings to the control unit resulting in bad air-to-fuel ratio. The catalytic converter was allegedly replaced at a Subaru dealership under recall. You should be aware of a Subaru recall on head gaskets: recall # wwp99. Hello, I have a 2001 Subaru Forester with 111,000 plus miles on its 2.5 liter engine. Cat fooler is not installed from the factory, its a cheat device. Ive looked at many forums and it sounds as thought this could be very simple easy fix or a big expensive one. Does this mean I have a lazy sensor that is going bad and a likely cause of p0420 code? However, this is not always the case, as a bad oxygen sensor can also trigger catalytic converter codes. EXHAUST & MUFFLER '02MY-'03MY. Your article says a possible cause is sometimes its just a small exhaust leak. Does this help determine if its the cat or something less expensive to fix (rear O2 sensor)? Webexhaust pipe containing the catalytic converter. Appreciate it! If its over 80,000 miles than you should budget for a Catalytic converter Replacement in the Future. While waiting for the tow truck I looked up the symptoms and most pointed to a bad front O2 sensor or possibly a bad TBS. everything worked fine for the first 300 Kms. I have already had the ECM flash done at the dealership. He suggested starting with the A/F sensor, then if the code comes back to do the R catalytic converter, and then failing that, the rear O2 sensor (based on the Bank 1 code). If the Catalyst isrestricted, in the way of carbon deposits, it wont reach temperature and as such wont function, it is possible in some cases to de-carbon theexhaustsystem, but only if that is the diagnoses. a Technician carried out a diagnostic procedure as per workshop manual checked resistance between relay and connectors which led to finding a blown fuse.20A Green. Poor acceleration The best advice I received was that the right front wheel bearings needed to be replaced. Failed inspection recently with a P0420 code. Kind regards, I drive about 60 miles round trip to work, mostly highway, and change the oil every 3k by the book. These are Subarus sold in the lower 48 states and Alaska. Great site Justin..and wish you were in Va. maybe you can assist me to understand what may be causing this faultany suggestion and i thank you for your time reading my concerns.. Hi Justin, For this test, all you need is a pressure gauge with its hose fitting. He says it will run about $1200 and its best to do all three at the same time. I would start with the higher octane fuel, some driving at higher RPMs at lower speeds and see if you can breath a little more life out of your Catalyst. Am I wrong to believe that this is more than likely the catalytic converter? Tightening the gas cap if its loose may correct the light , but more importantly why would you keep leaving the cap loose? oops again. Reading out the fault codes using a diagnostic device is relatively reliable. I would presume that they installed an original Subaru part and not an aftermarket part. Thanks once again so much for your wisdom! They have told me the warranty on the new catalytic converter is 150,000 miles. Thank you. It is important that you enter this 100% correctly, otherwise the result of the search may be inaccurate. Catalytic You can clearly see thedifferencesin the two high lighted readings, I have also made some changes in the time anddivisionportion of the Graph to help better show the data in question. You mentioned further testing is not free. I just purchased a used 2000 forester with 240k miles, the PO said the head gasket was changed as well as other maintenance but they didnt have any paper work. In late April I took my 2007 Forester, 59,000 miles, to a Subaru dealership to address recall WVU-31 from April 2011 (yeah, it took me a while!). If the Rear O2 sensor was tested out side of the data you gave me than yes the Catalyst is not reaching light off and will need to be replaced to satisfy the check engine light and the P0420 code. This commonly happens due to a bad upstream oxygen sensor, but can also happen due to a bad MAF sensor or worn spark plugs. Copyright 2023 Leaf Group Ltd. / Leaf Group Media. Hi Justin, Being Memorial Day the only thing I could do myself was tighten the gas cap. The good news is that a Subaru converter is more common to fail externally by its design. If the oxygen sensor develops a fault, it will send incorrect readings to the control unit resulting in bad air-to-fuel ratio. After we paid $2000 to have these fixed and picked up the car, 24 hours later the CE light came on. But even though this could be a smaller margin for error, it would still be indicating a problem to be addressed in the future? I would just be guessing. And ever since that repair, from time to time the CEL comes on and the cruise light blinks. If all is done well with the RIGHT parts you should be looking at this in the rear view mirror for years to come. The engine will die if I dont put it in neutral and give it gas.Any ideas on what is going on? Model Year Carline Affected Production Dates 2015-2016 Legacy 12/16/2013 9/30/2015 2016-2016 Outback 12/9/2013 9/30/2015 I do not know if that has anything to do with it but, I did add some 50/50 coolant. Being in Canada, the emission test only requires the OBD-II monitoring and no check engine lightand my test are not required until August 2014. Yep, need to get that code read! Since then I get at random times, can be a couple of days to a couple of weeks before getting the P0420 code up (this will reset straight away eveytime) It tends to come on when you just cruise along at a steady speed. I dont dispute that the catalytic converter probably needs replaced. Its got 95,000 mi. What do you think I should start with? 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